Welcome to the HeavyMetalPro Forums

It is currently Wed Apr 17, 2024 8:06 pm

All times are UTC-04:00




Post new topic  This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 Next
Author Message
 Post subject: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:54 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
We tried to come up with some updated LAM rules a decade ago and I recently started looking at them with thoughts of updating them to mesh with modern rules. Also the recent discussion on CBT about the IO Beta LAM rules suggested to me that they are unwilling to make the necessary changes to make me want to use those rules.

So if anybody wants to check them out, please tell me what you think. These are heavily based off the last version I have on record, with some modifications made for newer rules.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:55 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Land-Air BattleMechs

Rules Version 0.90

Land-Air BattleMechs, or LAMs, are a remnant of Star League technology swiftly disappearing from the modern battlefield. Jacks-of-all-trades and masters of none, in the middle of a battle, these fighting machines can change their configuration to that of a BattleMech, a fighter, or a hybrid mode with some of the advantages of both. LAMs served as highly mobile recon and light strike units for the Star League Army, and have continued that role into modern times. However, with the last factory lost to the Clans on Irece and converted to build OmniMechs, spare parts are hard to come by, leaving this uncommon class of BattleMech to become extremely rare as damaged LAMs are stripped to keep their surviving brethren operational. Though lightly armed and armored, LAMs are highly mobile enough to keep their heavier armed and armored brethren from ignoring them.

General Game Rules

LAM pilots need separate BattleMech and AeroSpace Gunnery and Piloting skills. They use BattleMech skills when in BattleMech mode and AeroSpace skills when in AeroSpace fighter mode. When in AirMech mode they use BattleMech skills on the ground and AeroSpace skills when in flight.

When the LAM’s armor is damaged, in any mode, damaged is marked off on the BattleMech record sheet. If the armor is penetrated, in any mode, damage passes to the internal structure. When the center torso’s internal structure is destroyed, the LAM, in whatever mode it currently exists, is destroyed.

A LAM’s SI is equal to one less than its tonnage divided by 10, rounded up, or its Thrust rating, whichever is greater.

A LAM is treated as if it has a Partial Wing for Jumping and Heat dissipation purposes.

LAMs in AeroSpace fighter mode only can mount external stores like bombs and fuel tanks, but they must be detached before the LAM attempts to transform. Safety systems will not allow the transformation with external stores attached. If jettisoning the stores, it takes one BattleTech turn to begin and complete the action. Overthrust is not allowed during this action. In space-based one-minute turns, it is considered an instantaneous action, but Qverthrust is still not allowed for that turn.

Conversions

It takes one full BattleTech turn for a LAM to convert from one mode to another and it can transform in space, air, or on the ground. When using space-based turns of 1 minute, simply choose the final mode. In either case they may move and make attacks during this turn, but with the restrictions listed below. When in space-based turns, use the restrictions from the last transformation. Also, certain critical hits will prevent conversion.

Restrictions While Converting
Conversion Type - Movement Restriction - Attacking Restrictions
BattleMech to AirMech - ½ normal BattleMech movement - +3 To-Hit Modifier
AirMech to BattleMech – ½ normal AirMech movement - +3 To-Hit Modifier
AirMech to Fighter – Normal AirMech movement – Not Allowed
Fighter to AirMech – Normal Fighter movment – Not Allowed

Critical Hit Conversion Restrictions
Critical Hit – Conversion Disallowed
Gyro or Hip – BattleMech to AirMech or AirMech to BattleMech
Shoulder or Upper Arm Actuator – AirMech to Fighter or Fighter to AirMech
Upper or Lower Leg Actuator – No conversions allowed

Capabilities

BattleMech Mode

While in BattleMech mode, a LAM is treated as a normal BattleMech with a Partial Wing for all combat and movement purposes. Partial Wing adds +2 Jump MP to the Jump Jets and provides –3 heat per turn.

AirMech Mode

Movement

When in AirMech mode, there are two main modes of movement. Ground and flight.

When on the ground, an AirMech moves as a regular BattleMech, but with reduced movement rates. Its Walking rate is one-third of its BattleMech Walking rate (round up). Calculate its Running rate from its Walking rate as normal.

When in flight, it follows all VTOL movement rules. Cruise speed is twice the movement provided by the jump jets. Do not include the bonus for Partial Wing. Calculate Flank speed normally. It takes 2 movement points to launch, at which time the LAM will begin it’s VTOL movement 1 elevation higher than the ground it started on. It also costs two movement points to land. The LAM must move into at least 6 hexes to stay aloft or be forced to land. Vertical elevation changes do not count towards this requirement. An AeroSpace Piloting skill roll with a –4 modifier is required to land safely. Treat a failed landing roll as a standard 1 level fall.

Combat

When on the ground an AirMech fires and takes damage as a normal BattleMech, with all appropriate modifiers. All physical attacks are delivered to the legs, or the upper body if one level above the opposing BattleMech.

When in flight, an AirMech generates a +3 Attacker Movement Modifier while cruising and +4 AMM while flanking. It also receives a –1 AMM for attacks against ground-attacking or low altitude fighters. An AirMech in flight can perform no physical attacks of any type. An AirMech in flight generates Target Movement Modifier per standard VTOL rules.

An AirMech cannot torso twist, but all other standard BattleMech firing arcs are used.

Damage

When a LAM changes from BattleMode to AirMech mode, its side torsos convert into wings. When an AirMech is hit by weapons fire, the regular BattleMech Hit Locations table is used. Once all armor on ether side torso is destroyed, the AirMech can no longer fly. If the side torso armor is destroyed while in flight, the LAM falls and crashes as per standard VTOL rules.

Damage to all other locations of an AirMech is handled per normal BattleMech rules.

Heat

When walking, running, or firing weapons, AirMechs generate heat like normal BattleMechs with a Partial Wing. The Partial Wing provides an additional –3 heat per turn of dissipation.

When in flight, AirMechs with standard jump jets generate 1 heat for each 3 MP used, rounding up. AirMechs with improved jump jets generate 1 heat for each 6 MP used, rounding up. In all cases, the minimum heat generated when in flight is 3 heat.

AeroSpace Fighter Mode

Movement

A LAM fighter follows standard AeroSpace fighter rules when in space. Due to a specialization in atmospheric design, LAM fighters are treated as AeroFighters when in the atmosphere. A LAM’s Thrust rating is equal to its Jump MP without being modified per Partial Wing rules. Calculate OverTrust rating normally.

Combat

A LAM fighter’s combat capabilities are equal to those it has as a BattleMech. Arm weapons become wing weapons, leg-mounted weapons now fire to the rear, and all torso weapons become nose weapons.

Damage

When in fighter mode, roll 2d6 as normal to locate the damage location for fighters. Roll another 1d6 on the following table to see which BattleMech location is hit under each fighter damage location. Mark that damage on the BattleMech record sheet.

Fighter Location

Nose
1-4 Center Torso
5 Center Torso (Rear)
6 Head

Left/Right Wing
1-2 Arm
3-5 Side Torso
6 – Side Torso (Rear)

Aft
1-3 Right Leg
4-6 Left Leg

For the purposes of damage thresholds and critical hits, add all armor under each fighter damage location and calculate the threshold as 10% of that total.

Heat

A LAM in fighter mode generates and dissipates heat like a standard fighter. When it atmosphere, it dissipates an additional –3 heat as if it had a Partial Wing.

LAM Construction Rules

Use standard BattleMech construction rules when constructing a LAM, but 10 percent of the LAM’s total weight (rounding up to the nearest half-ton) must be devoted to its conversion equipment. A LAM can never be heavier than 55 tons. OmniMechs cannot be built as LAMs. LAMs cost 1.75 times the standard BattleMech cost. The BV of a LAM is calculated with a movement modifier equal to three times its BattleMech Jumping range.

The conversion equipment comes with 160 points of fuel.

Fuel can be added 1 ton at a time. Each ton of fuel gives 80 points of fuel and takes up one critical slot.

All LAMs require jump jets as a part of their construction process.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:49 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
The IO Beta does have rules for LAMs.

It says all the stuff they can't do.

I don't have it in PDF though, so I can't easily reference it.

I was basing this set of rules off the Tactical Handbook version and trying to clean up things so they are not open to...abuse.

And I took the devs stated goal of wanting to give people reasons to use the other modes into thought with the ideas for BattleMech and AeroSpace modes.

I did NOT use whatever rules they have for 'Mechs in Space though. I'll have to look at wherever they placed those and see if maybe those would work better than the hit diagram we came up with a decade ago. ;) I just copied that into the new version of the rules. Hehehe.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:22 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Yes.

Ten years ago, the latest version of the rules was in FASA's Tactical Handbook. So that is what we were basing our rules on when we worked on this back then.

And so when I modified this with newer ideas and to work with the modern rules, I kept that same base set to work from.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 3:30 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Yes, the LAM Rules we worked on a decade ago predated IO by a little bit. It made sense back in the day to allow external stores ONLY when in AeroSpace Fighter mode, and so we allowed them.

On the Partial Wing bit. That also did not exist ten years ago. The stated goal of those who support the IO rules is to give people reasons to use the other modes rather than just LAM. Due to the many similarities between LAMs and Partial Wing-mounting BattleMechs I decided to add that benefit to LAMs in hopes of giving exactly that kind of incentive to use other modes.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 5:23 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I finally got IO Beta and have been looking at it. I decided to crib some of their charts in addition to making some of the tweaks necessary for the Partial Wing benefit to not unbalance things.

This necessitated a major revision number change up to 1.00, even those it is not what I consider out of Alpha Testing yet. Still, this is a heavy change over .90 and should be considered a different revision. Note that the main rules are still based on Tactical Handbook, pulling in stuff from IO Beta where it does not conflict with the Tactical Handbook.

Also note that I have not made any changes to the LAM Construction Rules. No time yet.

Land-Air BattleMechs

Rules Version 1.00

Land-Air BattleMechs, or LAMs, are a remnant of Star League technology rarely used on the modern battlefield. Jacks-of-all-trades and masters of none, in the middle of a battle, these fighting machines can change their configuration to that of a BattleMech, an AeroSpace Fighter, or a hybrid mode with some of the advantages of both. LAMs served as highly mobile recon and light strike units for the Star League Army, as well as special commando strike forces for the World of Blake, and continue those roles into modern times. But with the old Irece factory having been converted to build OmniMechs, and the World of Blake factories having had a rough time during the Jihad, spare parts are hard to come by though. That requires any pilot of this uncommon class of BattleMech to be very careful with their rides as heavily damaged LAMs are often stripped to keep their surviving brethren operational. Few LAM pilots will risk their LAMs in straight up combat against other BattleMechs, though LAMs are mobile enough to keep much heavier armed and armored BattleMechs busy at need. The need must be very great though.



General Game Rules

LAM pilots need separate BattleMech and AeroSpace Gunnery and Piloting skills. They use BattleMech skills when in BattleMech mode and AeroSpace skills when in AeroSpace fighter mode. When in AirMech mode they use BattleMech skills on the ground and AeroSpace skills when in flight.

When the LAM’s armor is damaged, in any mode, damage is marked off on the BattleMech record sheet. If the armor is penetrated, in any mode, damage passes to the internal structure. Because the side torsos become the bulk of a LAM’s flight surfaces, if either side torso’s internal structure is destroyed, the LAM can no longer fly in atmosphere in any mode. When the center torso’s internal structure is destroyed, the LAM, in whatever mode it currently exists, is destroyed.

A LAM’s SI is equal to the number of center torso internal structure points, or its standard Thrust rating in AeroSpace fighter mode, whichever is greater.

A LAM is given the benefits of having a Partial Wing in some modes.

Conversions

It takes one full BattleTech turn for a LAM to convert from one mode to another and it can transform in space, air, or on the ground. When using space-based turns of 1 minute, simply choose the final mode. In either case they may move and make attacks during this turn, but all attacks suffer from a +3 Attacker Movement Modifier. When in space-based turns, use the restrictions from the last transformation. Also, certain critical hits will prevent conversion.
Code:
Restrictions While Converting 
Conversion Type 	Movement Restriction 
BattleMech to AirMech 	½ normal BattleMech movement 
AirMech to BattleMech 	½ normal AirMech movement 
AirMech to Fighter 	Normal AirMech movement
Fighter to AirMech 	Normal Fighter movement

Critical Hit Conversion Restrictions 
Critical Hit 	Conversion Disallowed 
Gyro or Hip 	BattleMech to AirMech or AirMech to BattleMech 
Shoulder or Upper Arm Actuator 	AirMech to Fighter or Fighter to AirMech
Upper or Lower Leg Actuator 	No Conversions allowed


BattleMech Mode

While in BattleMech mode, a LAM is treated as a normal BattleMech with a Partial Wing for all combat and movement purposes. Partial Wing adds +2 Jump MP and provides an extra 3-heat dissipation per turn when in atmosphere.


AirMech Mode

AirMechs are 1 level tall and therefore do not benefit from partial cover.

Movement

When in AirMech mode, there are two main modes of movement. Ground and flight.

When on the ground, an AirMech moves as a regular BattleMech. Its Walking rate is one-third of its BattleMech Walking rate (round up). Calculate its Running rate as normal. A grounded AirMech cannot jump.

When in flight, a LAM follows all VTOL movement rules. Cruise speed is twice the movement provided by the jump jets. There is no bonus for Partial Wing. Calculate Flank speed normally. It takes 2 movement points to launch, at which time the LAM will begin it’s VTOL movement 1 elevation higher than the ground it started on. It also costs two movement points to land. The LAM must move into at least 6 hexes to stay aloft or be forced to land. Vertical elevation changes do not count towards this requirement. An AeroSpace Piloting skill roll with a –4 modifier is required to land safely. This modifier is not applied if being forced to land due to insufficient MP available to fly. Treat a failed landing roll as a standard 1 level fall.

Combat

When on the ground an AirMech fires and takes damage as a normal BattleMech, with all appropriate modifiers. All physical attacks are delivered to the legs, or the upper body if one level above the opposing BattleMech.

When in flight, an AirMech generates a +3 Attacker Movement Modifier while cruising and +4 AMM while flanking. It also receives a –1 AMM for attacks against ground-attacking or low altitude fighters. An AirMech in flight can perform no physical attacks of any type. An AirMech in flight generates Target Movement Modifier per standard VTOL rules.

An AirMech cannot torso twist, but all other standard BattleMech firing arcs are used.

Heat

A LAM is treated as having a Partial Wing for purposes of heat. It provides an extra 3-heat dissipation per turn when in atmosphere.

AirMechs generate heat like normal BattleMechs for walking, running, and when firing weapons. When in flight, AirMechs with standard jump jets generate 1 heat for each 3 MP used, rounding up. AirMechs with improved jump jets generate 1 heat for each 6 MP used, rounding up. In all cases, the minimum heat generated when in flight is 3 heat.



AeroSpace Fighter Mode

Movement

A LAM fighter follows standard AeroSpace fighter rules when in space. Due to a specialization in atmospheric design, LAM fighters gain access to the AeroFighter movement tables when in the atmosphere. A LAM’s Thrust rating is equal to its Jump MP without being modified per Partial Wing rules. Calculate OverThrust rating normally.

Combat

A LAM in AeroSpace Fighter mode fires weapons as if it were a Fighter. Use the following chart for individual firing arcs.
Code:
LAM FIGHTER FIRING ARCS TABLE 
BattleMech Location 	Fighter Firing Arc 
Head 	Nose 
Center Torso 	Nose 
Center Torso (Rear) 	Aft 
Left Torso 	Left Wing 
Left Torso (Rear) 	Left Wing (Aft) 
Right Torso 	Right Wing 
Right Torso (Rear) 	Right Wing (Aft) 
Left Arm 	Left Wing 
Right Arm 	Right Wing 
Left Leg 	Aft 
Right Leg 	Aft 
Heat

A LAM in fighter mode generates and dissipates heat like a standard fighter. When in atmosphere, a LAM is treated as having a Partial Wing for purposes of heat. It provides an extra 3-heat dissipation per turn when in atmosphere.



Damage

When in fighter mode, roll 2d6 as normal to locate the damage location for fighters. Roll another 1d6 on the following table to see which BattleMech location is hit under each fighter damage location. Mark that damage on the BattleMech record sheet.
Code:
LAM FIGHTER HIT LOCATION TABLE 
Die Roll 	Nose 	Aft 	Side 	Above/Below 
2 	Center Torso 	Center Torso§ 	Head 	Right Torso 
3 	Right Torso 	Right Torso§ 	Arm‡ 	Arm† 
4 	Right Arm 	Right Torso§ 	Center Torso 	Arm† 
5 	Right Arm 	Right Arm 	Center Torso 	Leg† 
6 	Right Torso 	Right Leg 	Torso‡ 	Right Torso 
7 	Center Torso* 	Leg†* 	Arm‡ 	Center Torso 
8 	Left Torso 	Left Leg 	Torso‡ 	Left Torso 
9 	Left Arm 	Left Arm 	Leg‡* 	Leg† 
10 	Left Arm 	Left Torso§ 	Leg‡ 	Arm† 
11 	Left torso 	Left Torso§ 	Arm‡ 	Arm† 
12 	Center Torso 	Center Torso§ 	Leg‡ 	Left Torso 



External Stores and Internal Bomb Bays

LAMs in AeroSpace fighter mode only can mount external stores like bombs and fuel tanks, but they must be used or jettisoned before the LAM attempts to transform. Safety systems will not allow the transformation with external stores attached. If the LAM is equipped with Internal Bomb Bays, all external stores must be used or jettisoned before firing internally stored weapons. Only internal fuel or TAG systems can be used if external stores are still attached. If jettisoning unexpended external stores, it takes one BattleTech turn to begin and complete the action. Overthrust is not allowed during this action. In space-based one-minute turns, it is considered an instantaneous action, but Qverthrust is still not allowed for that turn.

LAMs may be built with Internal Bomb Bays in the side torso locations. Since these are built inside the LAM, they remain intact throughout all conversions to all modes, and do not hinder any conversions. They also do not affect MP or Thrust ratings in any mode. When in BattleMech mode, only TAG and rocket launchers are usable. Jettisoning the bays follows standard rules for dumping ammo. When in LAM mode, they may be used or jettisoned per normal VTOL rules. When in Fighter mode, they may be used or jettisoned per normal AeroSpace Fighter rules.
Code:
LAM INTERNAL BOMB BAY ORDNANCE TABLE 
Bomb Type 	Description 
Air-to-Air Arrow 	20-point air-to-air missile (see p. 357, TO) 
Anti-Ship Missile 	30-point anti-ship missile (see p. 358, TO) 
Anti-ship EW Missile 	Capital-scale electronic-warfare missile (see p. 358, TO) 
Arrow IV Missile 	20-point air-to-ground missile, homing or unguided (see pp. 358-359, TO) 
Cluster 	5-point-per-hex air-to-ground cluster bomb (see pp. 249-250, TW) 
Fuel 	Provides 40 additional fuel points 
High Explosive 	10-point standard air-to-ground bomb (see pp. 249-250, TW) 
Inferno 	Incendiary air-to-ground bomb, generates 10 heat or damage (see p. 359, TO) 
Laser Guided 	10-point TAG-guidable air-to-ground bomb (see pp. 249-250, TW) 
Light Air-to-Air Missile 	6-point air-to-air missile (see p. 359, TO) 
Rocket Launcher 	Provides single-shot Rocket Launcher 10 to unit for air-to-air or air-to-ground use 
TAG 	Provides TAG weapon to unit (see p. 250, TW) 
Thunder 	Delivers 20-point standard minefield to target area (see p. 360, TO) 
Thunder Active 	Delivers 20-point active minefield to target area (see p. 360, TO) 
Thunder Vibrabomb 	Delivers 20-point vibrabomb minefield to target area (see p. 360, TO) 
Torpedo 	10-point air-to-water bomb (see p. 360, TO) 
Code:
Critical Hits

LAM CRITICAL HIT TABLE 
Critical Hit 	BattleMech 	AirMech 	Fighter 
Avionics 
First hit 	-1 Jump MP†††+1 Heat per turn††† 	+1 Piloting Modifier+1 Heat per turn††† 	+1 Piloting Modifier+1 Heat per turn††† 
Second hit 	-2 Jump MP†††+2 Heat per turn††† 	+2 Piloting Modifier+2 Heat per turn†††  	+2 Piloting Modifier+2 Heat per turn†††  
Third hit 	-2 Jump MP†††+3 Heat per turn††† 	+5 Piloting Modifier+3 Heat per turn†††  	+5 Piloting Modifier+3 Heat per turn†††  
Cockpit 	Pilot Killed 	Pilot Killed 	Pilot Killed 
Engine 
First hit 	+5 Heat per turn–2 Jump MP 	+5 Heat per turn, –2 AirMech Cruise MP* 	+2 Heat per turn–2 Safe Thrust* 
Second hit 	+10 Heat per turn–4 Jump MP 	+10 Heat per turn, –4 AirMech Cruise MP* 	+4 Heat per turn–4 Safe Thrust* 
Third hit†† 	Engine Destroyed 	Engine Destroyed 	Engine Destroyed 
Landing Gear 
First hit 	No Effect 	No Effect 	+1 Piloting to Land 
Second hit 	No Effect 	No Effect 	+2 Piloting to Land 
Third hit 	No Effect 	No Effect 	+5 Piloting to Land 
Gyro 
First hit 	+3 Piloting Modifier 	+3 Piloting Modifier 	+3 Piloting Modifier 
Second hit 	Gyro Destroyed‡ 	Gyro Destroyed‡ 	+6 Piloting Modifier 
Sensors 
First hit 	+2 To-Hit 	+2 To-Hit 	+2 To-Hit 
Second hit 	Weapon attacks impossible, regardless of current Movement mode 
Arm Actuators 
Shoulder 	+4 To-Hit† 	+4 To-Hit† 	+4 To-Hit† 
Upper Arm 	+1 To-Hit† 	+1 To-Hit† 	+1 To-Hit† 
Lower Arm 	+1 To-Hit† 	+1 To-Hit† 	+1 To-Hit† 
Hand 	+1 to Punch 	+1 to Punch 	No Effect 
Leg Actuators 
Hip 	Half Walk MP*+2 Piloting Modifier 	+2 Piloting to Land 	No Effect 
Upper Leg 	–1 Walk MP*+1 Piloting Modifier 	+1 Piloting to Land 	No Effect 
Lower Leg 	–1 Walk MP*+1 Piloting Modifier 	+1 Piloting to Land 	No Effect 
Foot 	–1 Walk MP*+1 Piloting Modifier 	+1 Piloting to Land 	No Effect 
Other Equipment 	Per normal rules 	Per normal rules 	Per normal rules 

 

LAMs do not suffer threshold criticals as Fighters or suffer from atmospheric decompression due to taking damage while in space or other toxic environments.
*Recalculate Running, Flank, and Maximum Thrust MPs normally (x 1.5). Always round up. 
†Affects weapons in that arm only 
††The third engine hit destroys the engine and the LAM shuts down, which may result in a no-thrust landing attempt (see TW, p. 86). 
†††Only applies when in atmosphere as the Partial Wing only gives benefits in atmosphere.
‡In BattleMech and AirMech Modes, the LAM will automatically fall and may not stand 
Code:
Critical Hit Conversion Restrictions 
Critical Hit 	Conversion Disallowed 
Gyro or Hip 	BattleMech to AirMech or AirMech to BattleMech 
Shoulder or Upper Arm Actuator 	AirMech to Fighter or Fighter to AirMech
Upper or Lower Leg Actuator 	No Conversions allowed
Code:
LAM INTERNAL BOMB BAY CRITICAL HIT TABLE 
Bomb Type 	Critical Hit Effect 
Air-to-Air Arrow 	Explodes for 20 points of damage 
Anti-Ship Missile 	Explodes for 30 points of damage 
Anti-ship EW Missile 	Explodes for 5 points of damage 
Arrow IV Missile 	Explodes for 20 points of damage 
Cluster 	Explodes for 5 points of damage 
Fuel 	Explodes on 2D6 roll 10+; 1 point of damage per point of fuel remaining 
High Explosive 	Explodes for 10 points of damage 
Inferno 	LAM adds 10 heat points in the current turn 
Laser Guided 	Explodes for 10 points of damage 
Light Air-to-Air Missile 	Explodes for 6 points of damage 
Rocket Launcher 	Explodes for 10 points of damage 
TAG 	Destroys TAG 
Thunder 	Explodes for 20 points of damage 
Thunder Active 	Explodes for 20 points of damage 
Thunder Vibrabomb 	Explodes for 20 points of damage 
Torpedo 	Explodes for 10 points of damage


LAM Construction Rules

Use standard BattleMech construction rules when constructing a LAM, but 10 percent of the LAM’s total weight (rounding up to the nearest half-ton) must be devoted to its conversion equipment. A LAM can never be heavier than 55 tons. OmniMechs cannot be built as LAMs. LAMs cost 1.75 times the standard BattleMech cost. The BV of a LAM is calculated with a movement modifier equal to three times its BattleMech Jumping range.

The conversion equipment comes with 160 points of fuel.

Fuel can be added 1 ton at a time. Each ton of fuel gives 80 points of fuel and takes up one critical slot.

All LAMs require jump jets as a part of their construction process.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:15 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Tactical Handbook Page 50 says that LAMs start with 30 points of fuel. At that time, each ton of fuel was 15 points, so that is where the effective 2 tons of fuel comes from.

With the modern rules having 80 points of fuel for each ton, that factors up to 160 points of fuel for LAMs to start with.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 2:28 pm 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
this is what HMPro gives me as a 20 ton LAM:
Code:
BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model:    Untitled 'Mech 
Tech:          Inner Sphere / 3025
Config:        Land Air BattleMech
Rules:         Level 3, Standard design

Mass:          20 tons
Chassis:       Composite
Power Plant:   120 GM XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 64,8 km/h
Maximum Speed: 97,2 km/h
Jump Jets:     6 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor Type:    Ferro-Fibrous 
Armament:      
  3 ER Medium Lasers
Manufacturer:  (Unknown)
  Location:    (Unknown)
Communications System:  (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System:  (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model:    Untitled 'Mech 
Mass:          20 tons
Construction Options:  Fractional Accounting

Equipment:                                 Crits    Mass
Int. Struct.:  33 pts Composite              0      1,00
Engine:        120 XL Fusion                12      2,00
   Walking MP:   6
   Running MP:   9
   Jumping MP:   6 [18]
Heat Sinks:     10 Double [20]              18       ,00
 (Heat Sink Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 1 LT, 1 RT)
Gyro:                                        4      2,00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors:                5      3,00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H    R: Sh+UA+LA+H   16       ,00
Armor Factor:   69 pts Ferro-Fibrous        14      3,85
 (Armor Crit Loc: 1 LA, 1 RA, 4 LT, 4 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL)

                          Internal    Armor
                          Structure   Value
   Head:                      3          9      
   Center Torso:              6          9      
   Center Torso (Rear):                  3      
   L/R Side Torso:            5        8/8      
   L/R Side Torso (Rear):              2/2      
   L/R Arm:                   3        6/6      
   L/R Leg:                   4        8/8      

Weapons and Equipment    Loc  Heat  Ammo   Crits    Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 ER Medium Laser        RA      5           1      1,00
1 ER Medium Laser        LA      5           1      1,00
1 ER Medium Laser        HD      5           1      1,00
6 Standard Jump Jets:                        6      3,00
 (Jump Jet Loc: 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 CT)
LAM Conversion Equipment:                    0      2,00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                         15          78     19,85
Crits & Tons Left:                           0       ,15

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost:        4.507.020 C-Bills
Battle Value 2:    757 (old BV = 895)
Cost per BV2:      5.953,79
Weapon Value:      297 / 297 (Ratio = ,39 / ,39)
Damage Factors:    SRDmg = 13;  MRDmg = 5;  LRDmg = 0
BattleForce2:      MP: 6J,  Armor/Structure: 2/1
                   Damage PB/M/L: 2/2/-,  Overheat: 0
                   Class: ML;  Point Value: 8
in what way would your rules affect it?
EDIT:
first: partial wings should give it a heat Rating of 21/23 instead of 21/20 wich is displayed during construction

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:04 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
The example LAM in question would have the following movement stats:

BattleMech - 6-9-8 (+2 for partial wing bonus) And as you noted could dissipate 23 heat in atmo so would be heat neutral.

Interesting thought...does a 'Mech with a partial wing pay heat for the extra two jump points? Probably. But I've never used one so don't know.

AirMech - 2-3 ground and 12-18 VTOL flight. Heat buildup for flight would be between 3 and 6 depending on how much is used, so still heat neutral when in atmo.

AeroSpace - 6-9 - And since heat buildup for ASFs is minimal, heat neutral in space as well.

overall that would be an effective LAM.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:16 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
And no problem on the misspelled named. I misspell myself often. Word spellcheck is my friend...hehehe

Yes, current BattleTech sources do say that Clan Nova Cat turned the last LAM factory into an OmniMech factory. :)

There have been rules for mounting external ordinance on ASFs since AeroTech 2 came out. Or was it AeroTech 2 Revised? I can't remember. One of those introduced them. I'm not sure if internal bomb bays were allowed back then. The rules have been fluid on those.

When working on these rules 10 years ago, there were no internal bomb bays for LAMs, and so the operating decision was that they be allowed to use external ordinance IN ASF mode only. Assuming they were loaded in ASF mode and never transformed out of ASF mode until after they were used.

The addition of Internal LAM Bomb Bays in the IO Beta may be an argument to no longer allow that. And IO Beta certainly says external ordinance is not allowed. But I am not seeking a rule set that is IO Beta compliant. I am looking for something that is easy to play and quick to understand. Though I will happily borrow from IO Beta when I think it has good ideas. hehehe.

As for whether or not HMP can design LAMs under IO Beta, the answer is a resounding yes. The IO Beta rules are more restricting than those in the Tactical Handbook in every way. The only additions to the design rules are avionics and landing gear that can easily be added as custom equipment. All other changes in IO BETA are taking options away from LAMs rather than adding option to them. Therefore HMP is completely capable of designing LAMs under the IO BETA limitations. I have generated all of the canon LAMs in HMP and they are IO BETA compliant.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:28 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
On Partial Wings. They did not exist 10 years ago. When I updated the last version of the rules we worked on here at HMP I chose to add their effects to LAMs. They don't actually HAVE Partial Wings since they have real wings. But I thought using the Partial Wing rules to give the BattleMech mode an advantage would give people a reason to use BattleMech mode, as that is the stated goal of those who support the IO Beta limitations on LAM mode.

And upon later thought, I considered having the heat dissipation special in all modes might work as well.

And giving LAMs in ASF mode access to the AeroFighter movement capabilities while in air would be another example of giving people a reason to use LAMs in ASF mode. Allowing LAMs access to both internal and external ordinance is another way of giving people a reason to use ASF mode.

In general these rules were designed to give people reasons to use all three LAM modes since each one has abilities that the others do not.

BattleMechs can jump farther.
AirMechs can fly pretty fast but can't jump.
AeroSpace can fly FASTER and even outmaneuver their pure space fighter brethren when in atmo.

Note that in all three cases, there are units of the same time that can do everything better than the LAMs. Their are BattleMechs that can jump farther and outgun it. There are VTOLs that can fly faster, and some that outgun them. And there are ASFs and even AeroFighters that can outmaneuver and outgun the AeroSpace mode.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:03 am 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
Mary had a Little LAM, its paint was White as snow and everywhere that Mary went, her LAM was sure to go.

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:53 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Yes...Mary had a little LAM...

Or as I loved to say in the past "Medron had a little LAM, it's fleece was black as coal..." ;)

On the weapons issue. Try the download here:
http://www.heavymetalpro.com/ProgramUpdates.htm

That download includes the Total War and other similar weapons in it.

Now onto other questions...hehehe

I contend that since LAMs have to use up internal tonnage that could be devoted to weapons to carry Bomb Bays, allowing the use of external ordinance as well would not be unduly unbalancing. I could be wrong though. That is just my first thought. Are ASFs allowed internal bomb bays? If so, I see no reason LAMs should not have both as well, in ASF mode.

I also doubt that any LAM will EVER be tournament legal. ;)

I did however add in a note that people can of course use the rules in Interstellar Operations once it is published and that these rules are compatible with any design that can come up with.

In the meantime, I have updated the construction rules to factor in everything in this rule set. Yes, these rules lack most of the limitations noted in IO Beta. I think those limitations suck. So I won't copy them here. I hope you understand. :angel:


LAM Construction Rules

Interstellar Operations is scheduled to have LAM construction rules in it. The game rules in this publication are fully compatible with any design resulting from that rule set. As that publication is in Beta testing and has not yet been published, this rule set includes construction rules based on FASA’s Tactical Handbook with some modifications.

LAMs are constructed using the standard BattleMech construction rules with some modifications.

A LAM cannot currently be designed that is heavier than 55 tons. There are rumors of larger designs built in the past, but present technologies have been unable to design a stable LAM heavier than 55 tons.

LAMs are highly specialized BattleMechs that rely on very tight balance controls to keep them in flight. OmniMech technology is therefore incompatible with LAM technology, as no known computer can balance the shifting loads of OmniTechnology with the rigid requirements of balancing a LAM in flight.

A standard LAM must devote 10 percent of the LAM’s total weight (rounding up to the nearest half-ton) to the conversion equipment. A Bimodal LAM must devote 15 percent of the unit’s total mass. The conversion equipment is represented by three Avionics crits (1 Head, 1 Left Torso, 1 Right Torso) and three Landing Gear crits (1 Center Torso, 1 Left Torso, and 1 Right Torso).

The conversion equipment comes with 160 points of fuel.

Fuel can be added 1 ton at a time. Each ton of fuel gives 80 points of fuel and takes up one critical slot.

LAMs can be designed with up to 20 Internal LAM Bomb Bays, 10 in each side torso. As they are internal, they do not affect the unit’s movement.

All LAMs must be designed with a minimum Jump MP of 3.

A LAM’s SI is equal to the number of center torso internal structure points, or its standard Thrust rating in AeroSpace fighter mode, whichever is greater.

LAMs cost 1.75 times the standard BattleMech cost.

The BV of a LAM is calculated with a movement modifier equal to three times its BattleMech Jumping range.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:58 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I just found something interesting while looking between Tactical Handbook and IO Beta.

They have completely different conversion penalties after taking critical hits.

I wonder if this is an error or on purpose.
Code:
Tactical Handbook Critical Hit Conversion Restrictions 
Critical Hit 	Conversion Disallowed 
Gyro or Hip 	BattleMech to AirMech or AirMech to BattleMech 
Shoulder or Upper Arm Actuator 	AirMech to Fighter or Fighter to AirMech
Upper or Lower Leg Actuator 	No Conversions allowed
IO Beta
Shoulder, Upper Arm and Lower Arm Actuator Critical
Hits: These critical hits will disable any conversion to or from
BattleMech mode, but the LAM may still convert between Fighter
and AirMech modes.

Hip, Upper Leg Actuator and Lower Leg Actuator Critical
Hits: These critical hits will disable conversion to or from Fighter
mode, but the LAM may still convert between BattleMech and
AirMech Modes.

Gyro Critical Hits: May not convert between any modes.
(Exception: As with bimodal LAMs, the first hit to heavy-duty
gyro will not disable conversion, but the second and subsequent
ones will.)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:39 am 
Offline
Antisocial General
Antisocial General

Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2003 8:35 am
Posts: 7883
Location: MLC, Lyran Alliance.
Seems to me that LAM's have gotten way too complicated. I don't remember them being anywhere near this difficult way back when.

_________________
Be careful what you wish for. I might let you have it. :evil:


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:52 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
This is downright simple compared to the IO Beta rules.

In what way would you like to see them simplified from this stage?

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 11:56 am 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
what is a bimodal LAM ?

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:17 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
It was their way of giving us the fluffed but never published Shadow Hawk LAM without giving us a real LAM.

It only has Fighter and BattleMech modes. No AirMech mode. And it costs 15% mass instead of 10% mass.

I may be giving them not enough credit, but the BiModal to me always felt like a bait and switch...

*shrugs*

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Last edited by Medron Pryde on Wed Nov 11, 2015 3:31 am, edited 2 times in total.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:18 pm 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
my example-mech above is illegal, it lacks the 6 critical Slots for landing-gear and conversion eq.

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:38 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
ON the LAM SI, I may have made a mistake. I take another look at that to see what I did wrong. ;)

On external ordinance, I added a specific mention of the 1-per-5 tons and reducing thrust issue in that part of the gameplay rules for version 1.01. I didn't repost the full rules though, only the construction rules as I considered that more of a clarification than a change. I apologize for the confusion that caused.

Here is the full download of the 1.01 rules.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 3:15 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
BTW.

There is a canon example of a Scorpion (quad) and a Champion (60 tons) LAM.

Hence the rumors bit for stuff larger than 55 tons.

;)

Also, page 114 of IO Beta says "A LAM’s structural integrity is equal to the number of center torso internal structure points." And the example of the Phoenix Hawk in the rules note that, in between all of the "can't do this" and "can't do that" notations sprinkled all over it...

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 2:19 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
The Scorpion LAM was another fluffed design that was later given stats in Experimental Technical Readout: Boondoggles, an XTRO devoted to giving us stats for designs that were never released into the mainstream market.

The Champion LAM was introduced in the same XTRO.


Note that the original LAM construction rules had no 55 ton limit at all. That was a later addition to the rules.


The newest rulesets in Record Sheets 3085 and IO Beta change AeroSpace Fighter cruise thrust to be the jump jet thrust they get. That allows LAMs with improved JJs with 6/9/9 movement in BattleMech mode to have a speed of 9-14 in AeroSpace mode. Not many do that though.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:01 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Yes, it may only be possible with a 10 or 15 ton LAM...

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 12:01 am 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
tiny LAMs however make Little sense. the weight leftover for weapons is small.

unless you want to Camouflage a LAM as a remote-control toy...

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 12:15 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I didn't say it would make sense.

Just that it might be possible. ;)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:11 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Level three rules allow BattleMech construction down to 10 tons in size. :)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:02 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Thank you for looking at them and giving good feedback on them.

I don't know the FULL history of the tonnage limits for BattleMechs. When I started playing in 92 the actual limits were 10-100 but no canon 'Mechs were published under 20 tons. Then one canon 'Mech at 15 tons was published, but FanPro/Catalyst decanonized it.

When the level 1/2/3 was introduced, anything below 20 tons became level 3, while 20-100 was level 1 and 2 rules.

FanPro/Catalyst stopped using the level 1/2/3 system, but Total War and Tech Manual are effectively level 2 and the Introductory rules are effectively level 1. Tactical and Interstellar Operations are effectively level 3 rules, and to my knowledge they do allow 'Mechs down to 10 tens. And the decanonized 15 ton 'Mech has been republished under Catalyst so it once again canon...

*sighs*

On the point of LAMs, there are only two sources for LAM rules in FanPro or Catalyst publications. Record Sheets 3085 Print version. And the IO Beta.

The last FASA publication to have rules for LAMs was the Tactical Handbook.

The LAM Rules .50 which is the last set of rules I've found on the forum here were based on the Tactical Handbook.

The LAM Rules .90 that I put out above were mostly Tactical Handbook with a little bit of clarification for a decade's worth of new rules and stuff.

The LAM Rules 1.0x are a bit of an amalgam of Tactical Handbook base with a fair bit datamined from the IO Beta.


If you don't mind me asking, could you tell me what exactly you don't like? For verification purposes that I'm understanding you correctly.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:26 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
The 15 ton 'Mech was originally published in the 1993 Update. It was a pamphlet/ad minimagazine sent to gaming stores by FASA in 1994 and had two new 'Mechs in it. Both 'Mechs were decanonized by FanPro/Catalyst. XTRO Republic I recanonized the Roadrunner and the Devil has been reported to be a modified Baboon...

As for the LAM rules:

External Ordnance is something we thought about ten years ago. Obviously before there were rules for internal ordnance. I can certainly see the argument for only allowing internal and no external. And your note about it being built as a BattleMech is a very good explanation for how to explain it if that is the way chosen. ;)

The Partial Wing bonus is all me. :) There was no Partial Wing in existence ten years ago. Those defending the LAM rules in IO Beta have said their stated goal is to give people reasons to use the other LAM modes other than just AirMech mode. So my idea was to look for something that would give BattleMech mode something cool to do that. The Partial Wing bonus got my attention. I thought that if a Partial Wing could give that bonus, why not a FULL Wing? Allowing the -3 heat in all three modes just ran out from that since I couldn't think of a reason to not allow it, though I wanted to be clear that no extra +2 move was given to the other two modes. That would be too much IMHO.

The "maneuvers as an AeroFighter" in atmo was also all me. Once again. A way of giving the ASF mode a reason for people to want to use it. Which honestly is one reason I support external ordnance on it. It is an option that would give people a reason to use a LAM in AeroSpace mode. And if that were followed, it could be fluffed as "strap on softpoints" or something like that. ;)

The amount of fuel included in the conversion equipment is extrapolated directly from the existing LAM rules. Strapping into the wayback machine there used to be 15 fuel points in each ton of fuel. A LAM had 30 fuel points, or two tons of fuel. Over a decade ago this was changed to 80 points of fuel for each ton. So when we were working on the LAM rules a decade ago we did the same math and got 160 points of fuel for the two tons of fuel that come with the conversion equipment. I guess I never considered changing that. And if the goal is to give people a reason to use AeroSpace Fighter mode, I'm not sure that taking away half the fuel would further that goal...

I agree on the Structural Integrity bit. I like the treatment in IO Beta better. That's why I cribbed it for the last versions of the rules. :)


In short, I want people to have rules for LAMs that are easy for people to use. I also want to give people reasons to use something other than just AirMech mode. The way I chose to do that for the .90 and above rules was to give BattleMech and AeroSpace Fighter modes abilities that AirMech mode does not have under those rules.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:41 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Actually, before Tactical Handbook, the only thing the wings did was give the LAMs a superjump capability of three times normal jump. THB's revolutionary idea was to make them fly like VTOLs OR be able to superjump. These rules remove the ability to jump, but then add a small bonus to jump when in BattleMech mode.

I agree that any fighter carrying external ordnance must lose speed and be limited by the other rules of external ordnance. Whether that fighter is a LAM in disguise or a normal fighter. ;)

I agree with you on the Internal Structure.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:51 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I need to sleep so I'm not going to look up the partial wing. Just don't have time...;)

The wiki has an article on them though.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Partial_Wing


As for external ordnance...I understand your POV and respect it. :)


On SI being equal to SI points. Yes. We agree on that. No safe thrust mode. Just SI points.


Thanks for making this a good rundown over the rules.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:32 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
You've been very much a help dude.

Trust me. Very much helpful. :)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 4:39 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I have uploaded another version of the rules.

This is mainly another go round after a couple months to make certain it says what I thought it says...and when it didn't I clarified or changed my wording. ;)

The current rules are based off the last accepted rules I could find on HMP, with a heaping helping of bits and pieces to make them more compatible with the rules in Record Sheets 3085 and the Beta release of Interstellar Operations.

As always, the end goal is to make a set of rules that makes playing LAMs fun while not overpowered.

It is my hope that these rules do that.

:)


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 1:47 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I noticed the formatting issue when I printed it to PDF.

In my word document it is one page, but when printing it does that.

I have modified the page enough that now it will print without doing that.

No idea why there is the difference.

Computers I guess. ;)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 7:11 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I have "finished" laying out the rules with art collected from Stephen Huda's Deviant art page to make it look really nice.

The pdf is too big to post here, so I added it to my P.R.I. page.

;)

http://www.pryderockindustries.com/dl_g ... p#LAMRules

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 2:35 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Yes, the IO Beta changed the conversion restrictions from those printed in Tactical Handbook.

As this rule set is based on the Tactical Handbook, with additions, I chose to keep the Tactical Handbook conversion restrictions.

As for the partial wing...partial wings and LAMs have never been linked before. LAMs existed long before partial wings, and partial wings were only introduced long after LAMs were out of print. So they've never gone together before. Now the wings of the LAM were ruled to erase ALL movement heat back in the day. Many people thought that was too powerful.

The Interstellar Operations Beta's stated goal was to encourage people to use modes other than LAM. It's way of doing it was to make LAM's useless. I disagreed with that direction and was looking for ways to POSITIVELY encourage people to use other modes.

Treating the BattleMech mode as if it has a partial wing (extra jump and extra heat dissipation) was I thought one way to do that. It is totally invented for these rules as a way to encourage people to use BattleMech mode. The BattleMech jump and the LAM flight difference is also a way of showing the two modes as being very different. Sometimes you want to fly. Sometimes you will want to jump. Allowing ASF mode to maneuver like AeroFighters was another pure encouragement to use that mode idea. Never in the rules before.

Once again, I took the approach of making LAM mode easy to play but not over or under powered, and then giving abilities to BattleMech and ASF modes that make them interesting to play with as well. There are pluses and minuses to all three modes with these rules, with none of them being useless in combat.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 2:47 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
In fluff and such, I would probably explain the rules by saying that LAMs do not have standard BattleMech jump jets. They have engines more like ASF fighters that are designed to run cooler and for extended periods of time. This allows BattleMech LAMs to fly farther with less heat generation. But since they are also designed for quick bursts, it allows ASF LAMs to move a bit more lithely than their purely space-based cousins.

The main idea with these rules though was to use existing rules that are easy to play. Tactical Handbook's VTOL movement when in flight for instance. Everybody knows how to fly a VTOL. They're easy. And the partial wing rules are easy too. Using those already written rules to reflect the unique abilities of LAMs is in my mind better than creating entirely new rules that people have to read up on and learn before they can use the LAMs in battle.

And they give unique abilities to each mode that will I think encourage people to use more than just LAM mode.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 10:09 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Thank you very much.

They are not merely my efforts though. I liberally cribbed from the Beta of Interstellar Operations, and of course this is based off of FASA's Tactical Handbook. And we've been working on these rules for years here at HeavyMetal. I honestly can't list everyone whose worked on these rules.

What I did was mainly start with the last set of rules we'd looked over here, and decide it was time to publish something based on them.

And I cribbed some cool art from Stephen Huda's deviantart page to make it look awesome. ;)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 12:33 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Thank you.

My site has been around since 1999, always devoted to the best in BattleTech programs and files. ;)

Though I haven't been updating it regularly for a few years now. Still...I keep it up and online because I've got some good stuff up there.

:toast:

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:13 pm 
Offline
Master Sergeant
Master Sergeant

Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 11:28 am
Posts: 89
the low mounted arms negative design quirk should be incompatible w/LAMs
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Design_Quirks ... unted_Arms


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:31 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I didn't really deal with design quirks.

Those are outside the construction rules so I just kinda ignored them.

:)

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 2:27 pm 
Offline
Master Sergeant
Master Sergeant

Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 11:28 am
Posts: 89
i agree with the Australians about chip burcham's (Natanya Smith's) rules for LAMs; they're really good
http://www.wargamerau.com/forum/index.p ... 71830&st=0


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 3:36 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
Well actually Natanya Smith's (chip burcham's) rules for LAMs are my draft, not his. Yeah, I do prohibit side torso locations from mounting turrets. Thanks for the compliment, Tom R.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:14 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
Tom R, Maximum Tech had rules for any turret mounted in the head of any 'Mech and any turret mounted in any side torso of any 'Mech provided tonnage and critical slot(s) are available, and I'm guessing that TO does also.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 1:33 am 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
I did not consider turrets when doing the LAM rules, but I do not see turrets and LAMs be incompatible.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 11:53 am 
Offline
Supreme Mugwump
Supreme Mugwump

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:42 pm
Posts: 3183
turrets on lams are not really a good idea, because they would create drag when flying through an atmosphere , depending on where they are mounted.
turrets on aircraft are a known thing in history, but usually they where used on relatively slow aircraft.

I would suggest to treat a turret as a bomb load, it slows down the LAM in atmosphere.

the real problem is how a turret converts, respectively where it can shoot.
it might be really interesting to create a LAM that could use all of its weapons in a 360° arc.
this would require a shoulder turret that folds up(to shoot into the upper hemisphere) or down( to shoot into the lower hemisphere)

_________________
typos and spelling-mistakes are property of the finder. english is not my mother-tongue.


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2016 2:38 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
You're welcome, Tom R. A 360 degree head turret, that is mounted in the head location of a LAM, wouldn't be able to rotate weaponry through the nose arm pieces; a 270 degree side torso turret wouldn't be able to rotate weaponry through corresponding wing front or wing rear side torsos pieces.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 4:47 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
Don't worry about having incorrectly identifying FASA AeroTech 1602 in earlier post.

Also, I would allow a LAM to mount and use a head turret as long as it's at BattleMech mode but not at aerofighter mode, and I'm not sure about a LAM mounting and using a head turret at AirMech mode.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:30 pm 
Offline
Loki
Loki

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2001 8:00 pm
Posts: 11444
Location: Minnesnowta
Quote:
The conversion equipment is represented by three Avionics crits (1 Head, 1
Left Torso, 1 Right Torso) and three Landing Gear crits (1 Center Torso, 1 Left Torso, and 1
Right Torso).
Given that the new Catalyst rules and my rules both place an Avionics crit in the Head, I'm not certain that there are enough free slots in the head (even with a torso cockpit if that can fit in the CT with the Landing Gear down there) for a head-mounted turret. Available space would be the primary determinant of that in my opinion though. I dislike arbitrary "unit can't do this" rules so did not create any rules pertaining to turrets and LAMs. In my opinion, LAMs would follow standard rules for turrets, whatever they are.

_________________
Medron Pryde - The Great and Terrible :blah:
[img]http://faileas.greywolf.googlepages.com/WOTD.png[/img]
[url=http://www.pryderockindustries.com]P.R.I.[/url] - The home of BattleTech programs and files
"I'm gonna Tea Party like its 1776." - Medron Pryde
Who is John Galt?


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:44 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
Quote:
The conversion equipment is represented by three Avionics crits (1 Head, 1
Left Torso, 1 Right Torso) and three Landing Gear crits (1 Center Torso, 1 Left Torso, and 1
Right Torso).
Positioning the Landing Gear crits like that means that a LAM that is landing must use its gyro to keep said LAM from "diving" forwards nose first and crashing, or "falling" backwards aft first and crashing.

What do you each think of chip's Balancer LAM?
http://www.wargamerau.com/forum/index.p ... pic=171990
I didn't take much interest that Balancer's pilot's "Halloween" traits nor did I prefer it have that Very Extended Range Small Laser in place of a standard Inner Sphere Small Laser, but it's still an interesting design.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: LAM Rules
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:57 pm 
Offline
Lieutenant, JG
Lieutenant, JG

Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 pm
Posts: 145
The fluff of the Balancer says it doesn't need a gyro because it uses its sensors to keep itself from falling (it's symmetrically balanced tonnagewise so a gyro is unnecessary). Yeah, I like it also. But a couple well armored tanks each providing covering fire for each other and using superranged artillery cannons such as Long Tom Cannons firing high explosive shots could defeat the Balancer easily.

_________________
Any rules ideas that I post for BT aren't official unless an up to date BT rulesbook declares otherwise. You might have to wait at least a fortnight for me to reply because I'm usually very active. I won't discuss real life politics or religion on any of these forum(s), but my favorite color is yellow like my skin color (hint).


Top
   
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 70 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 Next

All times are UTC-04:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
American English Language Pack © Maël Soucaze